Military Power

North Korea says it cut communications in response to what it calls "war exercises" underway between the United States and South Korea.

The United States deploys about 28,000 troops in South Korea to deter the North from invading South Korea, as it did in 1950. Top U.S. and South Korean officers say the annual exercises are routine and defensive in nature.

North Korea lashes out against the drills every year, but this year tension is heightened by North Korea's recent announcement it plans to launch a "satellite" in the near future. The United States and Japan view that as a cover for a long-range missile test. They have not ruled out the possibility of shooting the North's rocket down.

Pyongyang warns of dire consequences.

Source

So, what do you think about this? Just more rattling sabers? You think the U.S. will try to shoot the satellite down?

I think this is another major bluff. Unless.....North Korea and China are working together on this thing, because the recent activity with Chinese ships and aircraft making "close calls" with US vessels could be a sign from them stating to back off the war exercises with S.K. I don't though...this stuff is getting weird.

Maximus the Destroyer wrote:So, what do you think about this? Just more rattling sabers? You think the U.S. will try to shoot the satellite down?

Yes, I hope that we do shoot the satellite down. But, we all know that won't happen because the rest of the world would be up-in-arms over the whole deal. THEN all of sudden America is Public Enemy Number 1 because we shot down another country's satellite which was going to bring them up-to-speed on technology, and we wouldn't be able to prove that the satellite was actually a nuclear weapon being sent into orbit or else just a test dummy. Then after WW3 ignited, people would look back at America and wish they shot down that satellite. Funny how crap works these days. Everybody is a Commy...

Damn right the rest of the world would be up in arms. America is ALREADY public enemy number one after the whole Middle East fiasco, still ongoing I might add.

For a change it might be worthwhile gathering intelligence first before engaging in military operations in another nation. The whole WMD scenario is proof that going all cowboy in military affairs can, and will, lead to an unneccessarily messy situation and needless bloodshed.

If another country shot down one of America's brand new national defense orbital weapons platforms, America will be up in arms and declare war, yet everyone seems to think it's alright to enact the exact same scenario against another country and expect them to sit there and accept it. They won't. This whole "WW3" clause you used (very risque, I might add) would be exactly as plausable if they did or did not shoot the satellite down.

I'm all for shooting it down if it's proven to be for purely malicious military intentions, but America won't have my sympathies if they once again ignore the need for accurate intelligence, and they end up shooting down a benign communications satellite.

I suppose I'll be called a "Commie" or a "Hippy", as anyone who believes there are alternative recourses to war seem to be labelled.

Deimenried wrote:For a change it might be worthwhile gathering intelligence first before engaging in military operations in another nation.

Funny, England joined right in on that. If I'm not mistaken, the UK has it's own intelligence gathering organization, and if not, maybe they should consider investing in one instead of having the U.S. gather all their intelligence for them.

Deimenried wrote:America is ALREADY public enemy number one after the whole Middle East fiasco, still ongoing I might add.

I might add that if several thousand U.K. citizens were killed in a coordinated terrorist attack you might be singing a different tune about Afghanistan. I might also point out that the War in Iraq never ended. Saddam violated every provision of the cease fire (on many occasions) but the world was too ----- to do ------- about it. Oh, and by the way, if removing Saddam from power was wrong, the world can no longer say or do -------- about "ethnic cleansing".

Deimenried wrote:The whole WMD scenario is proof that going all cowboy in military affairs can, and will, lead to an unneccessarily messy situation and needless bloodshed.

Let me see here, during the first Gulf War we knew Saddam had WMDs. After the First Gulf war we kept inspectors there to keep track of their WMDs. Saddam repeatedly claimed he had and wanted more WMDs. He kicks weapon inspectors out on several occasions and each time they were allowed back in there were less. Do you honestly believe he kicked them out to destroy the WMDs and not hide them? Not to mention the large quantities of Yellow Cake Uranium that were found there...

Deimenried wrote:I'm all for shooting it down if it's proven to be for purely malicious military intentions

I dare see you try to PROVE anything has purely malicious military intentions. You can't even do that in the U.S. where we would let you (well, maybe not you, but an authorized representative) come in and "snoop around". I'd like to see you try that in North Korea. By the time you get your proof it will be too late because it will have already been used for the purely malicious military intentions. And what ----- do you care if North Korea has long range missile capabilities, you don't have any interests there anymore.

I'm sick and ------ tired of the U.S. being the ----- bad guy. No matter what we do it is never good enough for the rest of the -------- world. In World War One and Two we waited until there was an actual threat to the U.S. before getting involved and are criticized for that. We drop Nuclear weapons on Japan, saving countless thousands of lives on both sides and are criticized for that. In Iraq we do exactly opposite of our WWII stance and if there is a perceived threat to the region we get involved and are criticized for that. The world's economic crisis is our fault. Hunger and starvation in the world is our fault. -----, even Israel's existence is our ------ fault. It is a good ------ thing I'm not president. If I were I'd pull every U.S. soldier back to the U.S. and tell the world "good luck". And when the British, or Germans, or Saudis, or whoever starts crying to us for help, I'd tell them, "too bad. You didn't want us when we were around, you don't get our help now."


KnightTemplar: Removed the "colorful metaphors" that were very unneeded in this post

Oh, wow...Goliath what a "colorful" way of describing how you feel .

I do agree with everything you said Goliath. The United States is always the scape-goat for everything on this planet. Now I do admit, sometimes we put our noses where they shouldn't even be...like Religious Missions in other countries, but that is a whole other issue and I will not discuss further. But here is a great example of how America gets blamed for a lot of pointless shit: Global Warming. Because the US has huge industry, we automatically get the blame-stick for everything related to climate change. I did my own reading on it, and NO COUNTRY can be blamed for climate change (GF might be able to explain further, idk). To prove my point, the US is usually blamed for the earth's garbage (both politically and physically) because we are the Top Gun in the world, and everybody hates us because of that. I am quite sure that if Ethiopia were to become a Super-Power and become the top gun, everybody would hate them for it.

Because the US is the top gun, the US should have the right to make sure the rest of the world stays in balance and in check. That means prying our eyes and ears into radical countries movements and developments, giving advice when not wanted, and also warning and threatening other nations who are pushing themselves down the wrong road. But, who really cares? If we stop doing that, WW3 would become almost a reality and the rest of the world would come crawling to our feet to save them (and I hope we don't).

If it's any consolation, I do not scape-goat everything on America, especially not climate change. From what I've seen America is taking steps in the right direction, and that's good enough for me. But I digress.

Oh, and I applaud you, Goliath, for keeping such an air of civility. I made every effort to make my post impersonal and you just threw it back in my face and twisted my words. Well done. I hope you're proud of yourself, because it'll only be you anyway.

This is exactly the sort of arragance I have come to expect. I come here trying to maintain neutrality and you load up the bias. I accept you are fiercely patriotic, but it is actually possible to be so and not go out of your way to offend others.

Anyway, this is getting wildy off-topic. I suggest everyone else discuss this since any "un-American" input is clearly unwelcome, so go talk about "YAY, carpet bombing!" and "Hooray for nuking civilians!" without me since that's all this topic is destined to contain.

Enjoy.

Interesting. I would have sworn that the first official warning for a post would have gone to either Hobilar or CrazyCatman, not to Goliath, but I was wrong. As some of you probably noticed, the post has been edited for content as well.

Now, back to the discussion at hand....

Deimenried wrote:Oh, and I applaud you, Goliath, for keeping such an air of civility. I made every effort to make my post impersonal and you just threw it back in my face and twisted my words.

Yes, Goliath was very un-civil about this discussion, but, if you can look past that (I know it is hard to do) he does make Very Valid points. Also, as far as being impersonal, his replies, and oddly enough, even the last paragraph, were as impersonal as your comments. The only thing I could see being "personal" would be that he quoted you (as I did). And as far as twisting your words, I don't see it, I read your post the same way that it appears Goliath did.

Let me see if I can ask you a different way....

If Argentina started working on a nuclear program, and a long range delivery system for said warhead, decided to launch a "satellite" over the Falkland Islands without letting anyone know anything about it, what would the U.K. do? Do keep in mind that if you can put a satellite in orbit it is just a small step from there to make something land anywhere you want it to, anywhere on Earth, Say.... London.

Sure, you can't prove it isn't a communications satellite that is going to orbit for years, you also can't prove that it isn't a nuclear warhead that is going to land in the heart of Stanley. Do also realize that the Korean War never ended. North and South Korea are still in a state of war between them and the U.S. still has troops stationed in South Korea, so by default, North Korea is already in a state of war with the U.S.

Deimenried wrote:I come here trying to maintain neutrality and you load up the bias.

as far as your above comment, I don't recall Goliath calling the U.K. an enemy, however you blatantly called America "public enemy number one". That was straight from the second sentence in your first post, and drastically changed my perception of ALL of the rest of your following comments.

It seems we have established 2 lingering stereotypes as true:
1) ALL Americans are arrogant and go out of their way to offend others
2) ALL British hate Americans with an unquenchable hatred and go out of their way to offend them

It also seems that we have discovered why international forums don't work, everyone hates everyone and goes out of their way to offend everyone.

Well, one thing I can see that happened now since this thread was last posted to ...
N. Korea HAS test launched that MISSILE that most of the world has said that USA shouldn't worry about!
OR - was that just an "innocent communications" Missile?
Yeah, that is probably what it was - just a communications missile!

"communications missile". I like that. I;l have to use that elsewhere.